"Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true!"
-Homer J. Simpson

Tuesday, March 06, 2007

On the NDP Blogging Controversy Part II

Read part I here wherein a the administrator of the blogging dippers makes a comment that is in poor taste and as a result the blogging dippers, progressive bloggers, liberal bloggers and possiby the Federal NDP all go nuts.

Discussion Point 1 - Robert McClelland

He made the correct and valid point that he is not "in charge" of the blogging dippers nor is affiliated with the federal party. He also has worked to put up discussion pieces for the blogging dippers to work through this issue. I defend freedom of speech and so Mr. McClelland had every right to say what he said. However, it was (in my opinion) offensive and should not have been said.

Discussion Point 2 - Progressive Bloggers

However, for the progressive bloggers to summarily remove him from the blog rolls is a bit of an overreaction in my opinion. It is not as if there were not enough condemnations of him floating around the net that they could reasonably argue that his speech was being tolerated or accepted.
Couldn't they have made an editorial statement saying that these types of posts were not welcome and that if another one was made THEN he would be removed?

It just makes me wonder what I will say that will get me banned someday?

Update: And I am not the only one

Uperdate: I have modified this post so many times I have lost track, but I got some e-mails about this and I wanted to be clear.

1) Progressive Bloggers has the right to ban whomever they want - I just don't agree with this particualr decision.

2) Scott Tribe has been a gentleman about the whole thing: see here here and particularly here

Discussion Point 3 - Jason Cherniak

A post from my discussion yesterday said:

Frankly, given Jason's past BS attacks on the NDP, I quite frankly think that he is doing this for Rovian reasons - using the cudgel of anti-semitism as a weapon to attack his opponents and political enemies. I think his self-congratulatory post shows that. Anything for political advantage to the Liberals


right now I think Jason is one of the most dangerous people in the political blogshpere. Don't cross him, because he can fuck you up, as this incident clearly shows.

which I thought was a bit unfair (at least the second part). However, Jason is far from having clean hands on these types of issues as Eugene Plawiuk points out on his blog. Cherniak can try to spin this all he wants but the fact is that he was taking advantage of the situation to attack the NPD.

If you want Jason's arguments completely and utterly trashed then read this post by Idealistic Pragmatist on the topic. Or even (warning: blogging tory link) here

Update: to sum it all up I go to Mike's comments over here

Robert may insult my sensibilities, but Jason endangers my liberty. I know which of the two worries me more.
However, my major beef isn't with Jason, it is with the Federal Party that gave him the ammunition to do this, which brings me to my next point

Discussion Point 4 - The Federal NDP

I guess there will be a blogging dipper "official" blog roll from the Federal NDP. Hopefully this will lead them getting a freeeking clue when it comes to the blogosphere (read my comments from part I)

For example, why the hell does Cherniak get to throw these facts in my face (from the comments section of yesterday's post)

To be fair to your party, though, none of the NDP bloggers have a readership equivalent to me or Kinsella.
And he gets to add insult to injury by pointing this out in his blog:

When Jack Layton did a blog interview, it was with the head of the Blogging Tories. Today, when the NDP wanted to counteract Mr. McClelland's comment and disclaim any connection to him, they used me and Warren Kinsella.
these are all true facts, and the Federal NDP needs to give it's head a shake. If you want the NDP blogs to cover NDP-related news then, oh, I don't know......tell NDP blogs the news?

Nah, that'll never work.

However, this plan is not without it's own possible problems. As the Jurist points out this could lead to MORE of these types of situations, not less.

And for more possible problems read the post (and comments) over here

Discussion Point 5 - The Blogging Dippers

Major hat tips need to go out to Northern BC dipper for this

and the Mind of a Netjin for this

and especially leethaxor for setting this all up

Update: My comments posters corrected me - it was Netjin that set it all up - my bad.

The blogging dippers are starting to band together to deal with this situation and for that those mentioed above (and others if I forgot you) should be commended.

Unlike the progressive bloggers the blogging dippers are attempting to set up a democratic process with open and transparent debate.

I'm not sure this is the answer to the problem, but already the blogging dippers have proved to be better at dealing with this situation than either the progressive bloggers or the Federal NDP.